Evil Atheists In Utah

Brent Rasmussen's picture

It sounds like a pretty cut and dried separation case, doesn't it?

[link] The atheists say the 12-foot crosses put up by UHP to honor fallen troopers are unconstitutional. The group contends the crosses are religious, should not be on government land or have the UHP logo on them. "We need to find out how these troopers can be honored without violating the separation of church and state," Brian Barnard, lawyer for American Atheists said after Thursdays hearing. However, the UHP Association lawyer, Frank Mylar, said the crosses are used to memorialize troopers who paid the ultimate price by dying in the line of duty.

I don't have a problem with Highway Patrolmen killed in the line of duty being memorialized with a cross - except if it is embossed with the state Highway Patrol symbol, paid for by taxpayer dollars, and placed on public land.

Their reasoning? Well, the majority of the Officers being memorialized are Christian types.

It is quite simply unconstitutional to do it that way without guidelines providing for other faith symbols for non-Christian Patrol Officers as well. They only provide crosses. Period.

Get bent, all you jews, muslims, and atheists!

You'd think that the good citizens of Utah would support the removal of the crosses because it so blatantly violates the Constitution.

You'd be wrong.

The local TV and radio station KSL did a video news story on the cross controversy, and allowed comments on their website. Here's a few of them:

More below the fold...

Holy Cow!!!
by Mathew W. (#58553) @ 8:03am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Hallelujah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep. It's great that our secular goverment gives your religion special priveleges. Hallelujah indeed.

Sad...
by Corrine T. (#60840) @ 8:11am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Our world is so sad. Is this ever going to stop? Athiests, ACLU = Evil...

Dang it! She's onto us! Send in the black helicopters!

So we should go with the Minority?
by Brian B. (#52850) @ 8:13am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Regardless of constitutional rights, etc - the majority of Utahn's have no problem with these crosses. Don't those of us that think it is a great way to honor these brave souls, also have constitional rights that allow us to display these crosses? In my mind these fallen hero's have gone to a spiritual place (a.k.a Heaven), that is best represented by the crosses.

You do not have a Constitutional right to use MY government and MY tax money to buy your crazy religious symbols and display and maintain them on public land, moron.

Get A Job . . .
by Mal B. (#55442) @ 8:13am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Hail to the Judge . . .
I am glad we have a Judge that stands up to these court cases.
These UHP officers gave there lives in the line of duty.
Protecting these fools who want the crosses removed.

Where is it written that a "cross" only means Christianity.

Next they will want to remove ALL the crosses removed from grave sites.

To all the American Atheists Incorporated

Get a LIFE!!!

Uh, huh. The Christian cross doesn't really symbolize Christianity. Duh. Stupid atheist fools.

Score one for the majority.
by Todd H. (#42107) @ 8:26am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
The very, very small minority of pot stirring "Atheists" will somehow survive these horrible crosses.

Ooh! Scare quotes around the word atheists! Can you say "tyranny of the majority?" I knew you could.

Are they for real
by Charles J. (#44249) @ 8:28am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
You have got to be kidding. I am so tired of these people. If they don't want to see the cross then don't look at it. They are trying to run this great country in the ground.

"These people". Nice. Next, "those people" will be wanting to move into our neighborhoods and marry our daughters!

WASTE
by Garry N. (#27720) @ 8:33am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
What a waste of taxpayers money
Let the crosses stay and get rid of the people that dont have anything better to do than waste the money of us tax payers

Tell me Garry, should all us atheists just line up for the ovens now, or wait for the theocratic goon squads to bust down our doors and "get rid" of us?

(No Subject)
by J J. (#24903) @ 8:38am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
I hope the crosses stay. It is a great memorial and all those atheist nobodies need to quite causing grief among the families and do something constructive with their time.

It's a great memorial if you're a Christian, sure. What if it was a Jewish family that wanted you to buy, stamp with the official Highway Patrol seal, then place on public land a Star Of David memorial?

What if there were a LOT of them?

What if it was a Muslim memorial?

Yeah!
by Holly H. (#5023) @ 8:41am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
I'm SOOOO glad that there is still a judge somewhere who will tell those athiests to get a life. The crosses aren't religious, they're memorials.

Do you even read what you write? How in the fuck can a Christian cross NOT be religious?

Holy fucking Baby Jesus on a pogo stick - these commenters cannot be this stupid.

(No Subject)
by Dee M. (#25238) @ 8:42am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Good Move! If atheist don't believe in God or a superior being, and therefore symbols or religious symbols...then this should mean nothing to them...they need to get a life...many do not care what they think....God gave us brains, therefore they have none, not believing in God.

Nice that there is someone out there wanting to remember our fallen heros...God said Satan would be at work to destroy families and love of each other an man...and this protestor is Satan at work!

Could it be.... Satan?!?

CHURCH AND STATE!!!
by Tyler M. (#25651) @ 8:46am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
I've got some news for these atheist groups. You know something, this state was founded upont the principles of "CHURCH" and that's one of the things that makes THIS state great!!!!!!!!! You know what, there are plenty of other states in this country that live the way you like it (without a god), go there!! Nobody is keeping you here or making you believe something you don't!!! If you don't like it, don't let the door hit your --- on the way out!! Maybe you don't believe in God but whose to say that those who the cross is honoring didn't!! Maybe, for them, that's a great way to honor them. Just a thought!

Wow! I wonder where all those "plenty of other states" are that will allow me to live without a god? West Virginia? Florida? Crap. I gotta Google this. Who knew?

What's next.......
by Dwayne A. (#44270) @ 8:46am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
......removing all of the crosses and stars of David from Arlington National Cemetery.

Nope. Arlington allows the family to choose the symbol and does not restrict it to Christian crosses only. Well, unless you're a Wiccan, because let's face it, Wiccans aren't "really" religious. They're just duped by Satan.

?????
by Millie L. (#71014) @ 8:48am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Dear Utah Atheists,

I would like to ask you one question. Do the crosses physically impede you in some way? Is there an inordinate amount of tax dollars going to support their maintenance? One more question, why do you feel the need to make the majority concede to you, the minority (Americans are three times as likely to believe in the Virgin Birth of Jesus (83 percent) as in evolution (28 percent)http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/08/15/nyt.kristof/)?
What real and genuine harm does it do to you? I would like a sincere informative answer if you feel you can provide one. I would like to understand your point of view. Please remember one thing, as I always have guidelines (my little indulgence) just as I cannot concretely prove there is a God; please try not to prove there isn't. Just answer my questions. Make my Friday and enlightened one.

Let the family glean some comfort from "a useless wooden structure". Let it go. It seems that you don't have much of a choice now.

We all know that if a lot of people believe something to be true, then that means that it IS true, right Millie? Fuck yeah. Fuck you, atheists! You don't have much of a choice now, you evil bastards! Har-de-har-har!

rediculous
by Breanna O. (#81834) @ 8:49am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Would athiests be happier if we had big gravestones on the highways symbolizing a death? A cross symbolizes hope and remembrance, can the athiests let the people that have hope have this one thing? Its not hurting anyone else.

Uh, no. A Christian cross symbolizes, um, Christianity. Damn. Are you always this fucking stupid? Even I know that, and I'm an atheist.

Give me a break
by connie p. (#35782) @ 8:55am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
I am atheist but please..... Dont these groups have better things to do with their time then this. These people have given their lives to serve & protect. I think the least we can do is give them the credit they deserve, whether it be with a cross or not.. And yes, we should leave in god we trust in schools,on money, and in anything else it has been in/on for the last 150 years. That is what our country was founded on, beleif in something greater then ourselves. If you choose not to believe fine. Its just a cross, get over it and get a life....

Damned Uncle Tom. The Black Helicopters will be by your house shortly to take you to the nice EAC re-training facility.

What's up with Atheists??
by Z F. (#56961) @ 8:56am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Why are they so bent on symbols and how, when or where symbols are displayed. One small hint of secularism anywhere near government property and it's time to kick and scream on the floor like a spoiled child.

Atheists are cry babies. They make themselves look lame, stupid and foolish.

No, lame, stupid, and foolish is when you confuse the word "secular" with the word "sectarian".

Moron.

Honor the fallen troopers!
by Sean F. (#25283) @ 9:03am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Good for the judge! Thanks for stopping the activist Atheist whackos!

...because we all know that the Atheist whackos don't have any rights like us real Americans!

how far is it going to go?
by Ricky V. (#68374) @ 9:08am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Our County was based on RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, THE FREEDOM TO WORSHIP GOD.
Other countries forced their citizens to worship in the State church. This country was founded by people who wanted RELIGIOUS FREEDOM to WORSHIP GOD in the church of their choice. They were not taking God out of their lives, they were trying to get closer to Him. We live in a country that was founded on the belief in God. State and each individual person is free to show their belief in God as long as they are not telling the other that they have to believe the same way.
If you don't like the Ten Commandments posted, don't look at it, because that is what most of our original laws were based on, and if the world paid more attention to it, it would be more peacefull world.
If you don't like the fact that our country was based on the belief in God, MOVE.
Atheist' stop stomping on my rights!
I know I've probably made someone angry, and if you have to pick on my spelling or grammar, etc then go-for-it. But believe me you will be wasting your time, I LOVE OUR HEAVENLY FATHER and I BELIEVE that HE IS.

Dang, man. Sorry about stomping on your rights by not letting our secular government give your wacky religion special priveleges.

Our bad, man. Please don't kill us.

I'm amazed
by John L. (#71114) @ 9:10am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
It's shocking to me that a minority group that call themselves atheists can make changes like this, or even be heard in one of our courts.

I applaud the judge for throwing it out.

But like was said, they'll (the atheists) still get their day in court.

Isn't it about time we put people like Clark in his place, shut his mouth and ignore his kind once and for all ?

I can't imagine being a child of a person like that, and have to show my face at school, or even in public for that matter.

Thousands upon thousands of people see those crosses everyday, and I'm sure 99.99% of them respect and appreciate the tribute.

So how is it that one small insignificant individual can come along and be so ignorant as to actually take this to such extremes ?

No doubt people like that (atheists) were brought up in a different way than the majority of Americans.
Thank GOD for that ! Amen.

Let's see, in this one short comment, John L. asserts that:

  • Atheists shouldn't be heard in court.
  • Atheists and "their kind" should be ignored.
  • Atheists should be "put in their place".
  • Shouldn't have children.
  • Shouldn't show their face in public.
  • Are insignificant.
  • Are ignorant.
  • Were brought up differently than (presumably) decent folks like John L.
  • Are extremists.

But John L. isn't a bigot, oh no. He'd undoubtedly say that he's a patriot or some such bullshit.

I've got an idea, John. Say that same thing about "the blacks", or "the jews" and see how it tastes in your filthy, bigotted mouth, bigot.

Welcome to America
by Mike B. (#82207) @ 9:29am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
The phrase "separation of church and state" does not exist in the U.S. Constitution. Don't believe it? Go read it yourself and see. If Jesus said "This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" [John 15:12-13] then His symbol, the cross, seems a fitting tribute to the troopers who made the ultimate sacrifice for us.

Neither does the phrase "separation of powers". Let's do away with that one too!

Great!
by Shirley B. (#27730) @ 9:30am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
It is about time that the courts didn't bend to those that make the most noise. I for one am glad that the memorials will stay.

"I for one welcome our new Christian Overlords!"

Its about Time!!!
by Rob B. (#26312) @ 9:34am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
It's about time the courts told these crybaby atheists to take a hike and mind their own business. There case stands completely on a twisted distortion of the First Amendment to the Constitution. There is no separation of Church and State in the First Amendment. It plainly reads that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, of the press, or the right of the people to peaceably assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

Tell me where in this it say there is a separation of church and state? This amendment was written to keep the government from establishing a state sanctioned religion such as England did with the Church of England. It also was to prevent the government from keeping Americans from practicing whatever Religion they so choosed. It seems to me that the only goal of the Atheist's is to use the courts to in effect repeal the First Amendments guarantees to the freedom to practice religion and freedom of speech as it relates to Christians. Atheists completely ignore the fact that the First Amendment specifically says that no law can be made that prohibits the free exercise of religion yet they are trying to do just that through the courts. I think Christians should unite and file a lawsuit against this Atheist organization for violating our First Amendment protections. This would likely stop all the frivolous lawsuits they have been filing as of late.

You're absolutely right, Rob B. Let's just turn this country into a Theocracy, you know, since you obviously want to be controlled by the earthly representatives of a Magical Magic Man In The Sky. And by gum, the Muslims have a lot of practice at it, so we'll just let them handle all the details, OK?

Golly! I hope we get Sharia Law!

I think
by James D. (#68797) @ 9:42am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
atheists have too much time on their hands. You see, Atheists don't believe in anything so they have more time on their hands to torment those of use that do believe is something.

I believe I'll have another beer.

UHP road memorials
by Laurie A. (#82211) @ 9:42am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
Another instance of trying to remove God from our country that was founded on relgious freedom.

Another instance of an idiotic religious wackjob who can't tell The Constitution from her latest Christian Apocaplypse novel.

(No Subject)
by Kanion P. (#59597) @ 9:52am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
I understand that people have their own beliefs (although I think atheism? is a joke), but come on! These people have way too much time on their hands! How is this really affecting their lives so much that they need to take it to this extreme? Kudos to the judge!

Damned dirty atheists! They should stick to their atheistic comedy careers and leave us decent folks alone!

don'_ wan_ _o offend anyone
by Jason C. (#26260) @ 10:09am - Fri Aug 4th, 2006
_hank you judge. _his is in in rememberance of a brave person _ha_ gave _heir life in public service. If you don'_ beleive in god _hey have no meaning _o you. It _hey do have a meanng _o you, you mus_ believe in some_hing.

_hings jus_ don'_ make sense wi_hou_ crosses now do _hey

p.s. You can'_ even spell a_hies_ withou_ 2 crosses.

You are an idio_.

*sigh*

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Jackwob's picture

Too simple?

If a person happens to believe in a specific set of ideas and they fall in the line of duty (serving and protecting all walks of life and all their fun sets of ideas they have), why would it be so strange to have a memorial and who should fight against their family, friends, fellow officers?
I'm not religious, but I honestly wouldn't care if they threw a cross up to remember me by (I'd be dead, how could I?). Hell, they could throw a star of David over me or maybe a bronze bust of Mao? I think people must be pretty damn bored in Utah is the problem here. Boredom and not drinking causes political problems ... give them a beer and they'll sit on their porch, you won't hear from them again.

Of course, if I lived in Utah, I'd be off walking around Bryce or Zion or other such beautiful place. But now, if I find myself stumbling about and hit my head on one of these crosses, I sure wouldn't be too happy.

Whatever you do, just keep on fighting, it really shows off our abilities over the animals!

Anonymous User's picture

"I'm not religious, but I

"I'm not religious, but I honestly wouldn't care if they threw a cross up to remember me by (I'd be dead, how could I?)"

Yes, those troopers were mostly christian but that's not the point, what if one of the officers were of a non-christian faith? They would get a cross to be remembered. If i were muslim, i would not want a memorial with a cross because the cross represents jesus and christians. Everything that you say that represent the cross in good ways (EX: faith love rememberance) all derive from the bible and jesus. Think about it. Let's say Jesus was crucified on something other than a cross. Would you still think crosses would represent love and rememberance when they were used to torture and kill people? It's the simple fact that jesus died on it. If jesus died on something else then they would use that something else rather than the cross. So do you see that other religions get offended when something that they don't believe in represents something that they did? It's down right offensive. Which is why the atheists are like Hey it should not be a cross it should be something that symbolizes something that can be respected and honored by all people. So from what i'm reading your all pretty much against religious diversity. Your all hypocritical "get bent atheists, jews, muslims" when the bible flat out says love thy neighbor. IF anything atheists do better job at doing christian things than those who are not very educated on the bible. Crosses on govt land = no but it's perfectly fine if it's on their grave, a grave that represents their life and their beliefs. But not on govt land that should be religiously diverse for everyone. So sorry that we're trying to make it fair for other religions. "I'm not angry i just don't agree with you" So saying get bent to all the other religions to you is not being angry? I'd hate to see you when you're actually angry.

Amy's picture

Whooo

That literally made me nauseous. Enraged and nauseous.

milkywayinhabitant's picture

Reading this...just scared

Reading this...just scared the shit out of me. Seeing such ignorance like this on such a large scale really makes me feel uncomfortable.

Cerin's picture

Interesting

Now I understand why you replied to those posts here instead of on their site. I thought it was a little odd that all the posts were so one-sided. Then I tried posting a reply on ksl.com. After registering an account that required all personal information short of my social security number, I finally submitted my reply, only to find out it had gone to a "moderation queue". Even though my post was polite and civil (unlike most of the current ones) I doubt it'll ever see the light of day since I didn't say "amen" enough times or refer to atheists as "satan's children". I'm so glad a local news station is furthering a constructive mob...er, I mean debate.

mathyoo's picture

Our County was based on

Our County was based on RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, THE FREEDOM TO WORSHIP GOD.

And the freedom to NOT worship any gods.

If you don't like the fact that our country was based on the belief in God, MOVE.

Actually, our country was based on FREEDOM. If you don't like that, YOU move.

Atheist' stop stomping on my rights!

Which rights would that be? You're free to worship as you like and put up all the crosses you want, just don't make me pay for them and don't put them on government land.

One small hint of secularism anywhere near government property and it's time to kick and scream on the floor like a spoiled child.

No, we'd like to see MORE hints of secularism, please.

A cross symbolizes hope and remembrance, can the athiests let the people that have hope have this one thing? Its not hurting anyone else.

Actually, a cross symbolizes torture and death, or were you one of the few wingnuts who missed "The Passion"?

Dick Steele's picture

Wingnuts

To say that one is a "wingnut" if he misses a film (in this case "The Passion of the Christ")suggests a bit too much respect for lurid multi-million dollar film productions. Try reading a book.

Alon Levy's picture

I don't think it's what he meant

I'm pretty sure Mathyoo meant that nearly all wingnuts had seen the movie, but the wingnut in question probably hadn't judging by the fact that he didn't know the cross was a symbol of torture and death.

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